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Author Topic: Snell CII / AUDAX HM130C0 & Peerless 810921 & Scanspeak 26W/8861T00  (Read 44156 times)
Stefan I
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Posts: 141



« Reply #30 on: December 10, 2012, 10:54:53 PM »

Hello Vesa, I feel shame to say that my CII,s hasn't play music since at least half a year, my crossover is producing a peak in the upper midrange, it was obvious when i drove the midrange alone without x-over, then it sounded way smoother and more linear.
Probably it's some kind of phaseproblem, i am going to experiment with some different parallell values on the capacitors sitting in the upper crosspoint for midband.

The good thing is that my J/IV,s became so good with new drivers and with a lower tuning on port, so i am not out of enjoyable musiclistening. Wink

Though i do miss the lower frequencys that CII can produce, and of course the possibility to play louder. Cool.
My CII project will continue, the opportunitys are many, not to forget active filters (if i get empty on ideas), i am sure those speakers is all that i need when they are optimized near 100%, but it will take some time i'm afraid, work and family takes it's time.

Seems to be real winther up here, bought a pair of Skate-skis last week and soon it will be first run. Smiley

I will update my thread as soon something happens. Smiley

Best regards, Stefan
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 05:04:33 PM by Stefan I » Logged
Stefan I
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Posts: 141



« Reply #31 on: May 12, 2014, 06:05:07 PM »

Hello Vesa, how is it going with your stuff?
Have you done something since last or are you using them with same drivers and crossover? /Stefan

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vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #32 on: May 12, 2014, 07:35:24 PM »

Hi Stefan

Nothing, i must admit. Actually have been listening mostly with headphones lately. Upgraded to Grado PS500. They are not neutral but addictive Smiley

But you must have done some improvements on one of your pairs...?

/V
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Stefan I
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Posts: 141



« Reply #33 on: May 12, 2014, 09:05:14 PM »

He he, you think so.. Wink
Honestly no Sad, i was realizing that i had to buy some microphone equipment and a computerprogram for further improvements, there is where i am today, I know what the drivers is capable of, but the X-over isn't really up to it yet, they are in rest until i am preperad to put some hours on them again.
Latest speaker in for me is a pair of Audio physic step bookshelf, those speakers i consider have a very low coloration and going to be a true reference to compare with when the CII,s is back on track, unfortunately the AP,s don't have that beautiful 10" as needed..Smiley

Good to see that you are following the forum anyway, i need someone to coment in my thread that day i am making an update Wink

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vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #34 on: December 24, 2014, 02:09:20 PM »

Tjena Stefan

You have'nt done anything yet? Neither have i with speakers, but got 'ready' other looong time project - RIAA stage. http://sjostromaudio.com/pages/index.php/hifi-projects/133-qsxm3-the-extreme-phono-riaa-amplifier#.VJq40sAFA

Could not build it as standard, as standard is, but used superregulators instead of basic PS Wink

Not bad combination with my slightly modified CII:s...

/V


* RIAA_Overkillps.jpg (414.81 KB, 1632x918 - viewed 322 times.)
« Last Edit: July 03, 2017, 02:56:03 PM by vesaII » Logged
Stefan I
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Posts: 141



« Reply #35 on: January 21, 2015, 07:50:14 PM »

Interesting Vesa, what turntable are you using?

My CII,s are still stored, like good old wine.. Wink
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vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #36 on: January 21, 2015, 08:57:59 PM »

Hi Stefan

At the moment Alphason sonata with titanium and everything and 25years old Audioquest 7000 MC still playing insanely well. Just also changed PS for opamps in RIAA to 4x Tentlabs shunt regs. Shut regs simply are the best! Only too much is enough! It is so relaxing to DIY electronics instead of speakers. You just put best parts in and get better sound. See a new picture above.

Did also build a pair of Zaph audio 2-way ZRT:s for my friend. Very neutral and 'classy' sound but i maybe still prefer a bit more Snellish sound Smiley

Next thing is to adjust CII:s once more. I got some ideas while building ZRT:s and maybe also have done something wrong with new x-over on them.

Do not let wine go too old...

/V
« Last Edit: January 21, 2015, 09:08:14 PM by vesaII » Logged
vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #37 on: January 28, 2017, 08:34:40 PM »

Long time no seen...

Project has been on halt for a while, but today i left them for measuring with professional apparatus:
http://kimmosaunisto.net/Software/Software.html

It is free of charge and with it you can do wonders with your x-overs.

/V

36742
« Last Edit: March 01, 2017, 08:11:24 PM by vesaII » Logged
vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #38 on: February 28, 2017, 09:50:32 PM »

And now playing! Properly measured and simulated for new parts. Easy load even for tube amp.

3things
1) change polarity of woofer (Did it by poles behind)
2) use R7,2 for midrange and some R3,3 together with original pot for tweeter.
3) for rear speaker, should use 8,2-12ohm resistor.


* jii-LS08_ks.png (121.45 KB, 1920x1054 - viewed 89 times.)
« Last Edit: July 03, 2017, 03:08:20 PM by vesaII » Logged
Stefan I
Full Member
***
Posts: 141



« Reply #39 on: March 22, 2017, 04:57:40 PM »

Hi Vesa, who had that electronics to measure them up?
Did you have the energy-respons measured up at first, to decide place for x-over points?

What you do is exactly what i have to do myself, have someone visiting me at home with instruments, or i have to take the speakers with me on a trip..

Or make it simple and use your midrange and tweeter and copy your x-over.. Wink

Well, i think i go for my own challenge, i am very satisfied with how my drivers work separately, i think my Seas midrange work very well in the new midrange-enclosure when i play it without x-over.
The worst problem with my filter (as i experienced) was a narrow (but strong) peak in the upper midrange that i never got rid of.

My filter reminded of that original, with electrical slopes of 12/18 12/18 from bottom to top.
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vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #40 on: March 22, 2017, 08:21:59 PM »

Hello Stefan.

I was lucky. As a member of local HiFi community, i found a member who was kind enough to measure my box and design x-over for free. Or actually for a price of a good champagne Smiley
Measuring is the most time consuming an it is done on each element when fitted on box and of many angles. Of this data you can make simulations.

Iam afrad you need to buy some tools and learn to use Vcad your self. Actually microphone is not especially pricey and proper sound cards do not cost much. Vcad is free of charge. I presume if you can measure it, them Kimmo sure will help you with x-over design. Or maybe he knows someone near you.

What i have learned while discussing those 6 simulations my friend has done so far is: you cannot build good speaker without this kind of tool. It is obvious now. But what you can do is to implement this woofer x-over.

Also this idea of 12/18 electrical is not true, as only acoustical counts. And even slopes need to be symmetrical or phases go wrong, i'v learned. Mine is now about 2nd/2nd & 4nd / 4nd acoustically

Complicated stuff...

Actually, x-over visible here is not implemented yet. Mine is version 4 and it has some issues. And i need to modify midrange as well. It is 3mm below front face and it creates some bad waves on curve as you can see on picture.

This is short version of story. But i really encourages you to at least read Vcad/ARTA manuals.

And for those who prefer not to change elements. With Vcad it is possible to understand the ideology of original x-over and fine tune it further without loosing its Snell character. And if you cannot measure your speaker then it is practically impossible to improve it by changing values of components. Changing might sound good in some areas but if you measure it, you see how the total picture is anything but good.

So, my advice is. If you cannot measure and use Vituixcad or similar, then do not change values of components or replace different elements. Caps you can and should replace with same value and better quality.

btw. It would also be nice to see all original Snell speakers measured and simulated with original x-over layout and to see why they play so well as they do...

Best,
Vesa
« Last Edit: August 08, 2017, 06:01:55 PM by vesaII » Logged
vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #41 on: August 12, 2017, 09:00:30 AM »

Hi all

This might be useful when playing with xovers

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/software-tools/259865-xsim-free-crossover-designer.html

« Last Edit: August 12, 2017, 09:04:20 AM by vesaII » Logged
Stefan I
Full Member
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Posts: 141



« Reply #42 on: September 05, 2017, 06:07:57 PM »

Thanks Vesa, and believe it or not,, my CII,s are playing again after years of silence.
A new configuration for mid and top is now used.
I hope to show some pictures and explanations in my thread in a while. Smiley
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vesaII
Getting there
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Posts: 84


« Reply #43 on: September 05, 2017, 06:27:59 PM »

Hello Stefan!

Nice to hear of you. Hope you got a nice new configuration Smiley

I have not listen too much of speakers lately, but headphones. And got today a pair of SUPERB opamps. Just listening the Classic https://www.bursonaudio.com/products/supreme-sound-opamp-v6/

Did also an other mod for speaker mentioned here: http://www.snell.no/forum/index.php/topic,1292.0/msg,1498.html

Waiting for your pictures and impressions...

/V
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 02:51:11 PM by vesaII » Logged
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